| Author |
Comment
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petshark 
Board Monitor
(9/18/01 12:26:48 pm)
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Yes,
yes, keep religion in perspective
For heaven's sake, if we read the Bible closely we can find demented
ways of justifying terrorist activities. Whole sects are devoted
to such a view of God as vengeful, esp in the US. We probably have
the most varied collection of such "churches" in the world.
So although the Koran can be read this way or that way, the important
thing is to focus on how most Muslims are reading it today. That's
what affects us anyway.
I remember once someone saying that the worst thing to be when studying
religion is religious. Especially if you are not studying your own
religion.
And an small aside, anyone see Stigmata? Oh what a crazy
world we would all live in if we had individual relationships with
God instead of mediated ones
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Tricia
Perch Pro
(9/18/01 12:43:26 pm)
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Re: Yes, yes,
keep religion in perspective
Thank you, babzee and sarony. I agree with the quote about studying
religion, Petshark.
I haven't seen this news posted anywhere, and I thought it was important
that your president made this gesture. Regarding the acts of retaliation
in the U.S.: last week in Montreal a mosque was firebombed. In Hamilton,
Ontario, Canada a mosque was set on fire, and a Hindu temple as
well, so ethnically-motivated acts of "retaliation" by
ignorant hot-heads are not limited to the U.S. at all.
-----
From Yahoo News
By Arshad Mohammed
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Bush (news - web sites) visited
a mosque on Monday to urge that Muslim Americans be treated with
respect after last week's attacks, saying, ``The face of terror
is not the true faith of Islam.''
Slipping off his shoes to respect Islamic custom, Bush sought to
quell a surge of anti-Muslim incidents following Tuesday's attacks
on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, which left more than
5,000 missing or dead.
``These acts of violence against innocents violate the fundamental
tenets of the Islamic faith and it's important for my fellow Americans
to understand that,'' Bush said at the Islamic Center of Washington,
a mosque in the U.S. capital.
The visit was part of a broad government effort to crack down on
what the FBI said were dozens of "retaliatory hate crimes''
aimed at Arab Americans, including assaults, threats, arson and
two possibly ethnically motivated murders.
FBI Director Robert Mueller said the government had opened 40 hate
crime investigations in six days since the plane attacks ``Vigilante
attacks and threats against Arab-Americans will not be tolerated,''
he said.
Separately, the U.S. commission on Civil Rights ordered its national
telephone complaint hotline to solicit and catalog complaints of
discrimination from Muslims and Arabs and to hold forums on tolerance
across the country.
KILLING OF SIKH, PAKISTANI
Standing with Muslim American leaders in the Washington Mosque,
which has elaborate azure and turquoise tiles and stained glass
windows, Bush said: ``In our anger and emotion our fellow Americans
must treat each other with respect.''
Saying there are millions of U.S. Muslims who make ``an incredibly
valuable contribution to our country,'' Bush added, ''The face of
terror is not the true faith of Islam.''
U.S. officials have said Islamic militant Osama bin Laden, a Saudi
Arabian-born multimillionaire believed to be based in Afghanistan
under the protection of the radical Islamic Taliban government,
is their prime suspect in Tuesday's attacks.
Police are investigating whether the killings of a Pakistani grocer
in Texas and a Sikh gas station attendant in Arizona may have been
hate crimes triggered by the attacks. Officials believe Sikhs, who
wear turbans and beards, may be mistaken for bin Laden supporters
and targeted for attack.
FEAR OF HARASSMENT
The president said he had heard reports that some Muslim American
women who veil themselves have been afraid to go out since the attacks,
fearing they would suffer harassment.
``Some don't want to go shopping for their families; some don't
want to go about their ordinary daily routines because, by wearing
cover, they're afraid they'll be intimidated,'' he said. ``That
should not and that will not stand in America.''
``Women who cover their heads in this country must feel comfortable
going outside their homes,'' he added.
``Those who feel like they can intimidate our fellow citizens to
take out their anger don't represent the best of America, they represent
the worst of humankind and they should be ashamed of that kind of
behavior,'' he said.
Respecting Muslim custom, Bush, his White House aides and Secret
Service agents removed their shoes before stepping on the elaborate
carpets in the mosque, which sits in a leafy Washington neighborhood
surrounded by embassies.
At one point, the president quoted a translated verse from the Koran,
saying, ``In the long run, evil in the extreme will be the end of
those who do evil.''
Yusuf Saleem of the Muslim American Society thanked Bush and said
American Muslims were horrified by last week's attacks.
"We are also shocked and dismayed by the events, and dismayed
especially that it should be associated with a religion that has
only peace as its ultimate aim,'' Saleem said, adding, ``We are
a part of the fabric of America.''
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AZLady
Frequently Perched
(9/18/01 1:37:52 pm)
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An Afghani-American
Perspective
At least we've taken a few steps forward since Pearl Harbor.
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petshark
Board Monitor
(9/18/01 4:27:53 pm)
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Yes, I saw
some of those clips
announcing that we wll not tolerate hate crimes. It made me feel
a little better.
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Kira
Scurro
Perch Pro
(9/18/01 4:40:10 pm)
|
Re: Yes, I
saw some of those clips
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 6:10 PM
Subject: Namaste- From Gotham Chopra
My name is Gotham Chopra and I am Deepak's son. I work with Channel
One
News, an educational news broadcast that is seen in an estimated
12.5
thousand secondary schools, as a TV reporter.
On Tuesday September 11th 2001, at 8 am I boarded a flight in New
York
headed for Los Angeles. Shortly we rolled out onto the runway, lurched
back, fired down the runway, and soared into the sky. It must have
been
almost 8:30 AM when I looked over my shoulder and gazed out at the
New York
skyline noting the clear view from Columbia University, my alma
mater, all
the way down to the World Trade Center. "What a beautiful day,"
I thought
to myself. "I wish I wasn't leaving." I then closed my
eyes and drifted
off to sleep.
A little over 90 minutes later I awoke when the pilot's voice came
over the
loudspeaker. "Ladies and gentlemen," he announced in a
calm voice, "we are
making an emergency landing in Cincinnati because of an apparent
terrorist
attack in the New York Area. Please stay calm."
There was a nervous murmur throughout the cabin. The journalist
in me
demanded immediate information and I reached for the phone. I quickly
ran
my credit card through the phone, waited for the dial tone, and
dialed our
News Desk in Los Angeles. The phone cackled but when the other line
picked
up, there was no mistaking the panicked tone in one of my colleagues.
"Are you okay?" She asked.
"I am." I asked for further information.
"Two planes crashed into the World Trade Center. They've come
down. They've
come down."
The phone cut off and went dead. I frantically redialed.
No luck.
I tried my sister in Los Angeles.
No luck.
I slowly sat back in my chair and began to panic. I knew my father
had
flown out of New York on a different flight about an hour before
me. I knew
my mother was on a flight originating in London destined for San
Diego. I
tried to meditate and tell myself that everyone would be okay. Tears
burned
my eyes.
When we touched down twenty minutes later, the pilot instructed
us not to
turn on our cell phones. He gave us instructions to immediately
evacuate
the plane and follow the instructions of security personnel. We
did.
Finally in the terminal, I reached for my phone and turned it on.
There I
stood huddled with hundreds of other interrupted passengers and
gazed up at
the television. The fresh images of two smoldering stumps - the
remains of
the towers of the world trade center - played on the screen. Finally
I got
in touch with my sister, Mallika, who was sobbing on the other end
of the
phone.
"I'm okay.where's papa.where's mom?"
Mallika supplied all of the answers - everyone was safe. I placed
my next
call again to the office. I knew that there was work at hand. Sure
enough,
I already had a car reserved and was destined back for New York.
At the
rental agency, there was a great shortage of cars. People in line
started
shouting out their destinations and everyone began carpooling. I
joined two
other men from the New York area and we were off. Over the next
12 hours we
listened closely to the radio as details of the terrorist attack
emerged.
Every five minutes the name of another family member or friend popped
into
my head and I dialed the number frantically. Most New York numbers
were
jammed or out of service. One friend I was able to contact informed
that a
he was unable to contact a mutual friend of ours. He worked in the
105th
floor of one of the towers. He was scheduled to attend an 8:30 meeting.
Someone from the meeting had called to say they had survived the
initial
attack and were waiting for a rescue team. No one had heard from
any of
them since.
Finally just after midnight we made it just to the edge of New York
City,
in Fort Lee New Jersey. There would be no crossing into Manhattan
Island -
all the bridges and tunnels had been sealed. I spent the night in
New
Jersey unable to sleep much and by 6 am, I was dressed and ready
to get in.
The only way to get across was via the commuter train which was
offering
limited services. As we pulled toward the station in Hoboken NJ,
the trains
slowed to a stop. There on the other side of the river they stood,
like
ashen smoking gravestones, the ruins of the twin towers. The train
car was
silent and as everyone stood hushed and gazed out the window. A
young woman
beside me began to whimper. Another man lowered his head into his
hands and
muffled his sobs.
Back in the city, people walked around in a daze. The streets were
empty of
cars but full of wandering pedestrians, walking directly down the
middle of
Broadway and Fifth Avenue. As we made our way downtown (I had already
hooked up with a TV crew) we noticed small cafes open and people
filling
the outside sidewalk seats. People sat mostly in silence gazing
upwards at
the thick plume of white smoke still snaking its way westward. At
west 4th
street, a group of kids played basketball. At one point the ball
rolled out
of play. A young shirtless boy ran after the ball and bent down
to pick it
up. When he lifted his head he looked up at the air at the same
thick trail
of smoke. He shook his head and wiped away something from his eyes
- either
sweat or tears - and turned away.
Walking home, I stopped and talked to a police officer. After chatting
a
few minutes, the officer asked me if I would like to see ground
zero. I
agreed to stay just at the edge away from the workers. The pictures
on
television of the devastation caused by Tuesday's attack do the
scene of
the crime absolutely no justice. In real life it appears as if an
asteroid
has hit the lower part of Manhattan. There are charred, twisting
slabs of
metal and concrete in every direction. It is unfathomable, unspeakable,
incomprehensible. The tragedy today is in its infancy. For the thousand
who
lost their lives, there are thousands more - friends and family
- who will
never sleep a restful night. There are parents, children, siblings,
friends, and neighbors who walked out of their buildings one morning
and
have not returned. This is a national tragedy but also a very personal
one.
On Wednesday night while in cab returning from work to my apartment,
I
noticed the Muslim name of my driver. He noticed the tone of my
skin in the
rear view mirror. He nodded at me. On the radio, the commentator
was
relaying a warning to all men of Middle Eastern and South Asian
descent -
to be wary of unwarranted violent reprisals from agitated residents
of the
city.
The taxi driver again looked at me through the mirror and smiled
ironically, "We love America. It is our home." He shook
his head, "but I
think we're @#%$."
* * * * *
About a month ago, I rode up with two colleagues to the Northwest
Frontier
region of Pakistan bordering Afghanistan. We were covering a story
on
Islamic militancy training grounds based in Pakistani religious
schools.
In the west they have widely been reported to be ground zero for
the
grooming of young Muslim boys into hostile anti-western terrorists.
In
Pakistan, both the government and the men at the school hotly contested
these claims, castigating the west for generating such racist propaganda.
I
traveled to this lost area with as little bias as possible - but
with a
certain and undeniable fear in my heart.
In the school itself, the chancellor was most kind and hospitable.
He had
us tour the grounds of the school, meet teachers and some of the
boys -
though at first we weren't allowed to talk to them. We were then
escorted
into his private residence. The first thing I noticed on the center
table
was a bowl of big yellow mangoes and a picture. The picture was
of our host
- an older Muslim Mullah wearing a traditional white turban and
a stained
orange beard and his friend - Osama Bin Laden, the number one man
on the
FBI's list of Most Wanted. I asked our host if we could interview
him. He
agreed but insisted first that we share mangoes with him. I agreed
and he
took out a long knife and proceeded to slice the fruit for me. We
slurped
and chatted for a while and finally were permitted to turn on the
camera.
I asked the Mullah a wide array of questions. "Did he hate
the US? Why is
there such Anti-Americanism in this part of the world? Should Americans
be
afraid?"
He answered them all eloquently and without hostility. He talked
about the
history of the US and Afghanistan, how during the Cold War, they
were
allies, united fighting a war against the Soviets.
"You gave us weapons and trained our men. You built our roads,
fed our
people. Do you realize young man that your government helps to create
and
to fund the Taliban because it was their interest to use Guerilla
warfare
and terrorist tactics against the Russians? You made us your friend."
"But then your Cold War ended and you deserted us." At
this point, there
was a hint of animosity in his voice. " Because it was no longer
in your
selfish interest to have us as your allies, you abandoned us, left
our
people, hungry, and hateful. You turned your friends into foes because
you
used us like whores."
There was a silence between us.
Finally I asked him about the picture, about the nature of his relationship
with Mr. Bin Laden.
"He's an old friend. And a good man."
I shook my head. "Is he a terrorist?"
"We don't call him that here." The Mullah made it clear
he was not
interested in talking any more. We shook hands. I thanked him for
his
hospitality.
On the way out I thought about that hospitality. I knew that the
Mullah
himself had endorsed a fatwa, or religious order, by Bin Laden several
years ago urging Muslims to kill American civilians. But here was
this man
cutting mangoes for us and being very gracious.
"Today you are our guest. If we were not hospitable, we would
be very
ashamed. But in times of war, yes you would be an enemy and we may
kill
you. Today a friend, tomorrow, inshallah (God willing), there will
not be
one."
* * * * *
Today Friday September 14, 2001, four days since the terrorist attack,
it
appears we may be on the threshold of war. Our President has called
it the
First World War of the 21st century. I am not sure whom we will
be
fighting. I would like to go to my favorite café in the city - a
small
Egyptian place on the Lower East Side that I have been going to
since
college. The waiters - mostly young Middle Eastern guys who like
to talk
about basketball and soccer, who come and sit at your table and
share a
puff on the sweet tobacco hookas they serve there - they are my
friends.
But I'm not sure when it will open again, if it will open again.
There's a
Mosque next door that has been closed since the attack.
The weeks and months and perhaps even years ahead promise to be
complex and
wary. Hopefully our leaders will be judicious, precise, and compassionate
in the difficult decisions that lay ahead. But it is each of us
that now
must rise up and be the true warriors in this difficult time. Does
that
mean seizing weapons and braving the threat of death out on a battlefield?
Precisely not. Because the battlefield is invisible. The enemy is
elusive.
The web of evil too complex. Today there are no answers. It is too
early
for solutions for remedies. For now we each have our stories - where
we
were on the day that the twin towers toppled. Each one is dramatic;
each
one is tragic. From this day forward, everyday I shall observe a
quiet
remembrance for the victims of this calamity. Each one of us may
choose our
own way how to memorialize this moment but I believe we are all
obligated
to reflect for a moment, to care about our neighbor, to meditate
for peace
and tolerance because ultimately the only forces that can defeat
such
profound evil are compassion and hope.
I ask everyone on this board to join my father and me in prayer
for the
healing of our wounded civilization (if we can call it that). Let
us pray
every day to our Gods remembering, as my dad has taught me since
childhood,
that Christ was not a Christian, Mohammed was not a Mohammeden,
Buddha was
not a Buddhist, and Krishna was not a Hindu.
Love,
Gotham
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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~BELIEVE~
|
petshark
Board Monitor
(9/19/01 5:17:25 pm)
|
Wow. Thank
you so much, Kira
This is going to sound sappy, but it reminds me of an episode of
"Touched by An Angel" I just watched, about a girl trying
to prove the existance of God to her atheistic parents. (yes, I
watch sappy stuff occasionally, like late night Disney Channel movies)
She writes two papers, one a scientific discussion of the theory
of an intelligent plan to the universe, and the other a personal
essay about looking up at the stars. Of course, the second works
better than the first. This story reminds me of that, how the personal
narrative can be so much more articulate than the academic study.
I am sure there are thousands of academic essays on why this is
true, I know I have read a few, but the poets and story tellers
often do it better.
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Chili 
Perch Pro
(9/19/01 5:28:07 pm)
|
Oh, duh, I
knew I'd seen it...!
Thanks, Petshark, if you just bumped it...!
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Kira Scurro
Perch Pro
(9/19/01 6:09:15 pm)
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you are so
welcome, pet...
it really struck me, too. more so than all the news accounts. the
man is a great writer...and a very kewl soul, too. 
~BELIEVE~
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Tricia
Perch Pro
(9/19/01 6:10:01 pm)
|
Re: Wow. Thank
you so much, Kira
Oh, don't sell short the ability of a good astronomer to find the
mystical in the universe - that's the appeal of astronomy for many
of the scientists - you can read all the books you want, and sit
in front of a computer all night analyzing radio telescope signals,
but with a good foundation of knowledge about just what is going
on "up there", nothing beats a Deep Sky Observation Workshop
for oohs and ahhhs.
Even a slide presentation of the ages and colours of galaxies, the
further and further 'back' you go, makes me dream.
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petshark
Board Monitor
(9/19/01 6:35:26 pm)
|
Re: Oh, duh,
I knew I'd seen it...!
Lol, bumped it and moved it too. It started out on the RR board
but I thought it may be time to let the revelling resume
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